Wearing Uniforms Post-Release/Retirement (merged)

[MARS]

Do you navy guys wear it when you're driving the boat or something? Is it some hellish way of keeping the duty officer awake? Standard dress for boarding parties after 1800hrs

:rofl:

 

[dimsum]

If it is an 'active duty' uniform, should not the RCN provide it out of the pubic purse?

I really hope not.  :-X

 

[Sub_Guy]

If it is an 'active duty' uniform, should not the RCN provide it out of the pubic purse?

If no, then why should people keep shelling out shekels for something they won't ever be allowed to wear after they depart.

That's my take, if I paid for it, I will wear it and do whatever I want in it.  Prior to the implementation of the points system one could have made a weak argument that the clothing upkeep allowance paid for it.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

I really hope not.  :-X

Was Freud at play there? I don't know!!! Corrected, thank you.

 

[George Wallace]

If it is an 'active duty' uniform, should not the RCN provide it out of the pubic public purse?
                                                                                                        ^typo^

I know that in the 'Army' these 'active duty uniforms' do come out of the public purse when being done up for Honourary Colonels and Colonel in Chiefs. 

Now speaking of Honourary Colonels and Colonel in Chiefs; they ARE NOT SERVING members.  Would the logic of this topic therefore preclude them from wearing 'active duty uniforms'?    >

 

[Old Sweat]

In view of the fact that their appointment is approved by the chain of command, that implies approval to wear uniform on appropriate occasions in the performance of their duties.

 

[The Bread Guy]

I know that in the 'Army' these 'active duty uniforms' do come out of the public purse when being done up for Honourary Colonels and Colonel in Chiefs. 

Now speaking of Honourary Colonels and Colonel in Chiefs; they ARE NOT SERVING members.  Would the logic of this topic therefore preclude them from wearing 'active duty uniforms'?    >

Good point, but already covered ....

(....)

6. THIS NAVGEN DOES NOT AFFECT HONORARY APPOINTMENTS ....

<tangent> BTW, whazzup with the "no u" in Honorary???? </tangent>

 

[Towards_the_gap]

Good point, but already covered ....<tangent> BTW, whazzup with the "no u" in Honorary???? </tangent>

Maybe when you know your message is going to piss off a whole raft of people, what's the point in proofreading it?

 

[George Wallace]

It is the Anti-Christ Bill Gates and Microsoft Spell Check being 'Murican.    ;D

 

[dapaterson]

I know that in the 'Army' these 'active duty uniforms' do come out of the public purse when being done up for Honourary Colonels and Colonel in Chiefs. 

Mess kit is not paid out of the public purse for honoraries.


And Milnews.ca: Since you don't have enough money to donate to a unit that would appoint you, there will be no "U" in honorary.

 

[George Wallace]

Mess kit is not paid out of the public purse for honoraries.

I was thinking DEUs.


I imagine, any retired honoraries would have their own "grandfathered" mess kits. 

 

[OldTanker]

From my perspective we have two issues here: First, the wearing of obsolete, historical uniforms in such a manner that there is no chance for confusion that the wearer is still a serving member. A good example is the oft-shown picture of the ex-RCN rating in his square rig. Nobody would confuse him with a serving member, nor does he pretend to be one. I see nothing at all wrong with this and any ham-fisted attempt by the CF to forbid this deserves the derision it is getting. If I could fit my expanded frame into my 1960's era kilt and battledress and wear it as part of some commemorative ceremony or parade, I might and so what? Who would be offended? On the other hand, I find the habit of retired members, mainly retired officers wearing contemporary uniforms such as mess dress in a manner and in a setting where confusion with serving officers is possible, odious. This is why we have blazers with regimental/corps badges, lounge suits and black tie with miniatures, etc. available to be worn when required. I still have my mess dress in storage, but foresee no time or reason to wear it.  In fact, if any serving member wants a Cavalry mess dress (44" chest, 5'9") at a very good price, just PM me  I WAS a soldier, I'm not anymore, I have no need to try to impress people or relive my past glories (or whatever) by playing dress-up. But the RCN certainly could have come up with a better worded policy. Just my :2c: worth.

 

[bigcletus]

Just read this in the TO Star this am...

Good on you Sir..

"Jack Aldred, an 89-year-old World War II Navy vet, plans to march in uniform on Canada Day without asking permission."

 

[Ostrozac]

Good point, but already covered ....<tangent> BTW, whazzup with the "no u" in Honorary???? </tangent>

That's the spelling used in Queen's Regulations and Orders.

QR&O 3.06 - HONORARY APPOINTMENTS

QR&O 3.07 - HONORARY RANK

So I guess that's the official spelling according to the Queen's English.

 

[Towards_the_gap]

On a side note, I googled the 'difference between honorary and honourary' and found a thread even drier than this one!!

 

[The Bread Guy]

That's the spelling used in Queen's Regulations and Orders.

QR&O 3.06 - HONORARY APPOINTMENTS

QR&O 3.07 - HONORARY RANK

So I guess that's the official spelling according to the Queen's English.

Indeed, including where the Queen lives - this from page 8 of "BR 3 NAVAL PERSONNEL MANAGEMENT FEBRUARY 2013 EDITION" ....

"Royal and Honorary Ranks and Appointments"

Meanwhile, a "clarification" via the Info-machine:

To the Editor:

I regret that a lack of clarity and misreporting of a recently released internal order related to the wearing of uniforms after release from active service has resulted in avoidable confusion and insult to veterans.

The Royal Canadian Navy holds veterans in the highest regard and has no intent or authority to limit the wearing of older orders of dress, such as wartime patterns. Historic headdress, medals, and uniforms that are no longer in use are explicitly exempt from our authority.  Their use in celebrating previous service and sacrifice should continue and be encouraged.

The intent of the order was simply to inform serving members – and by extension those retired members still affiliated with the RCN through our messes and other organizations under our influence – of the protocols associated with a long-standing regulation about wearing current pattern uniforms, specifically Mess Dress (a formal evening uniform), after retirement. This specific pattern of uniform still exists and is worn by active serving members. It is important therefore to avoid any confusion in identity between those who are on active service and those who are retired and no longer subject to the same rules and expectations as their serving colleagues.

The desired outcome is to have a process that both respects the regulations as well as honours those who are no longer serving.

(signed) Vice-Admiral Mark Norman, CMM, CD
Commander RCN

 

[tango22a]

Well... some kind soul better pass this on to a past RSM when he parades with the Naval Vet's Colour Party in fore and aft rig!!!


tango22a

 

[dapaterson]

On the subject of lack of clarity, methinks the Admiral needs to re-read the NDA to understand what "Active Service" is; here's a hint: the Primary Reserve, generally, is not on active service.  Thus the uniform does not distinguish those on active service.  One would hope that the senior leadership of the military is acquainted with the foundational legislative basis of the organization...


However, since he wants to avoid confusion, here's a simple solution: Serving sailors are wearing the War of 1812 pin.  So as long as a sailor isn't wearing it, that sailor isn't in the current uniform, so problem solved!  And as an added bonus, it actually makes the War of 1812 pin useful!

 

[Tank Troll]

:goodpost:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAryFIuRxmQ&feature=player_detailpage

milpoints in bound

 

[cupper]

Umm. I'm confused. The editorial is signed by VAdm Norman.

Previous posts attributed the NAVGEN to VAdm Maddison, as perhaps a last act prior to retirement.

I can only assume that if the above is correct, that VAdm Norman felt it was necessary to do a stoop and scoop to clarify the missive.