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FELEX - Halifax Class Modernisation

Ziobrop

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2 of the frigates (HMCS Halifax and HMCS Fredercton) are getting addtional Task force command features that currently only exist on Iroquois and Athabaskan. The biggest physical difference  on the outside is the addtion of the 2 large communications domes on the hangar, which will sit on extensions under the aft fire control radar.

 

Occam

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Ziobrop said:
2 of the frigates (HMCS Halifax being one) are getting addtional Task force command features that currently only exist on Iroquois and Athabaskan. The biggest physical difference  on the outside is the addtion of the 2 large communications domes on the hangar, which on Halifax will sit on extensions under the aft fire control radar.

Your information is pretty inaccurate.  Are you referring to the domes shown on FRE here?  http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2012/11/fredericton-and-montreal-felex-update.html
 

Ziobrop

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Opps. Mixed up Fredricton and Montreal in my head.
Halifax and Fredercton Have the Mods. Montreal will not.
 

Occam

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Some of the CTG modifications are being applied to all 12 of the Halifax class.  Some, like the domes you've mentioned...are only being applied to specific ships.
 

AlexanderM

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So had HMCS Winnipeg just come out of FELIX?  Then this collision.  I hope the damage isn't too bad.  Another article I read indicated that the Winnipeg had just undergone a massive refit and systems upgrade. 

So, she was returned to the RCN on April 10th and then this happens.  If you see the video it's quite a collision.

http://globalnews.ca/news/504436/u-s-fish-boat-collides-with-docked-navy-ship/
 

Occam

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Yes, WIN had just finished the contractor phase of FELEX at VSL.
 

The Bread Guy

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Bump with the latest ....
Canada’s 12 Halifax-class frigates continue their planned modernization with a $15 million contract awarded to Bronswerk Marine Inc. of Brossard, Quebec, for the replacement of the ships’ chilled-water systems.

(....)

The contract will directly create or sustain jobs in the Brossard area. The contract will also have indirect benefits for the workforce, as approximately 85 per cent of the chilled-water systems’ content and technology are Canadian-made.

This contract covers the purchase of 50 chilled-water plants and pumps, with four units allocated to each frigate, and one training unit for sailors on each coast. Chilled-water systems provide the cooling capacity needed to operate the array of systems onboard the frigates.

The units will be delivered between 2014 and 2018, well before Canada’s Federal Halocarbon Regulations bring into force a ban in 2020 on R22 coolant, which is used in the existing systems on the Halifax-class fleet. The new chilled-water systems will use a coolant compliant with these regulations.

The chilled-water system replacement is a sub-project under the Halifax-class Modernization/Frigate Life Extension project ....
DND/CF Info-machine, 21 Aug 13
 

The Bread Guy

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Bumped, again, with the latest ....
The Honourable Rob Nicholson, P.C., Q.C., M.P. for Niagara Falls and Minister of National Defence, today announced the successful modernization of the first four Halifax-Class frigates. The Halifax-class modernization/frigate equipment life extension (HCM/FELEX) is a $4.3 billion program to upgrade and enhance the existing fleet. The program has remained on budget and is scheduled to be completed by 2018.

Following recent sea trials, Her Majesty’s Canadian Ship (HMCS) Fredericton is currently preparing to deploy as the first modernized frigate at high readiness in early 2015.

As the Royal Canadian Navy undergoes its most extensive peacetime modernization in history, the 12 Canadian-built multi-role patrol frigates will continue to form the backbone of the fleet. The first four frigates to be modernized as part of the HCM/FELEX are HMCS Halifax, Fredericton, Calgary, and Winnipeg ....
Also attached in case link doesn't work for you.
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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Quote:
"As the Royal Canadian Navy undergoes its most extensive peacetime modernization in history, the 12 Canadian-built multi-role patrol frigates will continue to form the backbone of the fleet."

I underlined in yellow. My view: It would not have been even necessary to modernize at all if the government hadn't delayed the follow on program of SCSC's. Had they gone right into such program, as was recommended by the Navy, the first SCSC's would have come out around 2004-2005. After replacement of the last IRO around 2009, you would have kept on going to replace the oldest HAL as they got to about 20 years old. No need for any modernization program. You could even had put some of those HAL in reserve for five to ten years or sold them to less fortunate friendly navies, such as South American ones. 
 

Occam

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You've got to go back a few years decades before you can find RCN ships that served less than 20 years of service before being paid off. 
 

Occam

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Interesting video of all the work being done during FELEX at this link - http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2014/11/felex-update-first-4-done.html?spref=fb
 

Pat in Halifax

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Occam said:
You've got to go back a few years decades before you can find RCN ships that served less than 20 years of service before being paid off.
Ahhh, you should never throw a challenge out like that:
HMC Ships Anticosti and Moresby.

But, sadly, what you say is true. Not counting wartime ships, I think the only other one...ever, was the Tribal HMCS Micmac which was decommissioned just shy of 20 years. That was because of a collision in which her keel was bent though.
 

Occam

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Pat in Halifax said:
Ahhh, you should never throw a challenge out like that:
HMC Ships Anticosti and Moresby.

But, sadly, what you say is true. Not counting wartime ships, I think the only other one...ever, was the Tribal HMCS Micmac which was decommissioned just shy of 20 years. That was because of a collision in which her keel was bent though.

Doh...I probably should have been more specific.  Anticosti and Moresby had more than 20 years of service (not all RCN) on their hulls when they were paid off, which is what I actually meant.

Some of the St.Laurent and Restigouche classes had fewer than 20 years on their hulls when they were paid off.

I think (and I'll have to confirm today at work) that the Halifax class was expected to have more than a 20-year service life - how much more, I can't recall.
 

Pat in Halifax

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It is actually referred to as ELE - Estimated Life Expectancy and HAL (I am pretty sure) was 25-30. The issue up until IRO was not the hull but the combat system and it was never feasible to replace beyond obsolescence. Some of the STLs and follow on classes were actually in pretty sound shape mechanically when they decommissioned.
I remember doing a paper on this a couple years ago and the only non third-world country that kept ships around longer than us was the USN (USS Lexington for one-just shy of 50 years)

Oh, and only ST CROIX came close to less than 20 years service (15 Oct 54 – 15 Nov 74)
 

Occam

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That's the same figure I've seen - 25-30 years - but I'll be damned if I can find a reference this morning.

St.Laurent, Chaudiere, St.Croix, and Columbia were all commissioned fewer than 20 years.  You're using laid-down dates, I looked at commissioning dates.  Either way you look at it, they were pretty young compared to the long lives their sisters endured.
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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25 to 30 years is not a fast rule but a NATO average service time for the smaller ships (that is cruisers and smaller - 45 to 50 years for aircraft carriers and large phibs is pretty standard), with the Brits and American closer to 25 and the French and German closer to 30. All of this is, however without major redesign, like we do with our life extension programs all the time. The Brits tend to use ships for about 12 years in commission, then lay them up for a mid-life refit, where some aspects are modernized, but mostly all the machinery is taken apart and repaired/refurbished over a year, then go back in commission for another 10 to 12 years.

If, as I suggested (and was proposed by the Navy) we had started replacing the HAL's in 2010 (after replacing the IROs), and replaced them at a rate of one every 12 to14 months, the first ones would have been retired near 20 years of age - without the need for extensive life extension -and the last one would have been retired around 2023 after 27 years of service. The number of operationally available ships (15) would have been maintained throughout,  with a reserve of 5 or 6 of the best retired HAL's on hand for a bit of quick expansion or replacement here and there as required due to long refits or major breakdown/accidents.
 

Pat in Halifax

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Occam said:
That's the same figure I've seen - 25-30 years - but I'll be damned if I can find a reference this morning.

St.Laurent, Chaudiere, St.Croix, and Columbia were all commissioned fewer than 20 years.  You're using laid-down dates, I looked at commissioning dates.  Either way you look at it, they were pretty young compared to the long lives their sisters endured.
I had a copy of the original SOR written in 1978. I'll see if I can find it.
 
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