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2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

Remius

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PP is a master at using social media. He’s effectively leveraged it more than any other leader since social media became a thing. He’s getting his message out.

But that comes with the many advantages pitfalls of using social media. Use it irresponsibly to your peril.

Certain demographics won’t care because the internet might as well be sorcery to them.

Others and likely younger understand the concept of hashtags and how they can be used for good or for bad. If you are over 35 you probably are oblivious to it. So it’s understandable why some people don’t care.

It’s no different why JTs followers don’t care about the various political manoeuvring like supply arrangements and prorogations or committee procedures to limit debate. The don’t really understand it so they don’t really care about it.
 

Navy_Pete

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That's a lot of critics. Are any of them actually qualified in any way for the items they are supposed to be critiquing, and do they intend to try and work with the incumbents to actually fix things?

Actual ministers just have to be smart enough to listen critically to their SME advice from the departments and figure out what to do, I'm not sure how they will do anything comparable with their random office staff.

Sounds like they are setting up for soundbites and the next election vice any meaninful changes now.
 

IKnowNothing

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Exactly what changes are you expecting the opposition to make in our sitting parliament ?
By taking a less adversarial stance and leveraging his seats Jagmeet forced a decent shift in the agenda of the sitting government.
There's appetite in the Liberal caucus (and the electorate) to pull the Liberals back to the centre.
 

Halifax Tar

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By taking a less adversarial stance and leveraging his seats Jagmeet forced a decent shift in the agenda of the sitting government.
There's appetite in the Liberal caucus (and the electorate) to pull the Liberals back to the centre.

The whole of government needs to take a less adversarial stance. And you want the opposition to lead that change ?

The Cons/Opposition cant pull the Liberals back to center. That's the job of the electorate.
 

IKnowNothing

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The whole of government needs to take a less adversarial stance. And you want the opposition to lead that change ?

The Cons/Opposition cant pull the Liberals back to center. That's the job of the electorate.
I want the Conservative Party of Canada working to influence policy for the betterment of Canadians. It might be years before we see another election. Minority governments can be influenced. The CPC has been outmanoeuvred and that influence is being better wielded by the NDP. That's not trolling, it's fact.
 

Halifax Tar

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I want the Conservative Party of Canada working to influence policy for the betterment of Canadians. It might be years before we see another election. Minority governments can be influenced. The CPC has been outmanoeuvred and that influence is being better wielded by the NDP. That's not trolling, it's fact.

There is no oppositional influence in the GoC or HoC right now. The Lib/NDP alliance is exactly set up to keep Conservative influence impossible.

What exactly do you want them to do ? Right now the Lib/NDP have essentially made 5,747,410 Canadians mute.

Its laughable that you expect the CPC to some how pull power away from the NDP in our current real scenario. And if that's not trolling then you don't seem to grasp the temperature of current situation and partisanship in the HoC.
 

IKnowNothing

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There is no oppositional influence in the GoC or HoC right now. The Lib/NDP alliance is exactly set up to keep Conservative influence impossible.

What exactly do you want them to do ? Right now the Lib/NDP have essentially made 5,747,410 Canadians mute.

Its laughable that you expect the CPC to some how pull power away from the NDP in our current real scenario. And if that's not trolling then you don't seem to grasp the temperature of current situation and partisanship in the HoC.
There was under O'Toole. The "current temperature" was not the case last year. Hence "outmanoeuvred" being in the past tense. The CPC is far from blameless in their sidelining. They invited it.

Not saying it will be easy, or instant, but it's literally their job. 4 years is a long time. A long time to be working across the aisle, influencing backbenchers, actively contributing to committee in a beneficial way, undermining the supply in confidence by providing a more palatable alternative.
 

Halifax Tar

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There was under O'Toole. The "current temperature" was not the case last year. Hence "outmanoeuvred" being in the past tense. The CPC is far from blameless in their sidelining. They invited it.

Not saying it will be easy, or instant, but it's literally their job. 4 years is a long time. A long time to be working across the aisle, influencing backbenchers, actively contributing to committee in a beneficial way, undermining the supply in confidence by providing a more palatable alternative.

Lol so wait I need to clear this up, with the CPC opposition under O'Toole the HoC was in some way a less partisan more productive place place ?

And now you're blaming the hyper partisanship on one party.

You sir, are a troll.
 

IKnowNothing

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Lol so wait I need to clear this up, with the CPC opposition under O'Toole the HoC was in some way a less partisan more productive place place ?

And now you're blaming the hyper partisanship on one party.

You sir, are a troll.
It most certainly was. It was still adversarial, and there was still sniping, but as I said- it was not at the current temperature. O'Toole lost the party because he was too moderate.

And no, I'm not blaming the hyper-partisanship on one party, I'm saying that the CPC infighting and decision to embrace it created a Liberal need and an NDP opportunity that previously didn't exist.

Was Scott Aitchison a troll?
 

Halifax Tar

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It most certainly was. It was still adversarial, and there was still sniping, but as I said- it was not at the current temperature. O'Toole lost the party because he was too moderate.

And no, I'm not blaming the hyper-partisanship on one party, I'm saying that the CPC infighting and decision to embrace it created a Liberal need and an NDP opportunity that previously didn't exist.

Was Scott Aitchison a troll?

Ahh this about your distaste for PP. Gotcha. Now I that I understand your context it all makes sense. I think you're wrong, but I can see your position now.

No, the Liberal/NDP alliance was created for the simple reasons that they are close in policy and need each other to push through their, generally shared, desired vision for the country. It has nothing to do with sniping from the CPC benches. The CPC is powerless. And it has been since it first lost to the Liberals, the last election I voted Liberal as well.

Scott Aitchison was my first choice on party ballots.
 

Navy_Pete

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I think Canadian political parties need to quit being so pure if they want to actually have influence and form government in various alliances. If you look at many other parliaments the actual ruling coalition can have some pretty weird bedmates, but they can actually get some of the things they want kind of done.

Looks like some kind of improved health/dental coverage is pending, so in very real terms the NDP has been more effective in getting things in their platform implemented with 25 MPs than the CPC with 118.

I think there is enough popular support that they could probably get both the BQ and (some) NDP/Liberal MPs onside with some kind of short term GST/carbon tax pause to offset the current inflation impacts, but that requires them to maybe do something other than whinge like losers and actually work with other parties across the aisles.

Real life requires compromising and working with others all the time, and they could maybe actually do something if they paused the attack mode. The LPCs know they currently don't need to, and won't need to unless the CPC changes tact. The people in the lead don't have to do anything other than stay the course.

Or you know, we could just collectively just sit around blaming the other side for doing nothing but keep the morale superiority and hope for the best. That will keep the lights on and food in the fridge.
 
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