• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,260
Points
1,260
I understand the feeling. I really can’t see myself voting LPC as long as JT is there.

But my counter is to have enough Right of Center/red tories that can help balance the party and effect change and have influence from within. It’s a long term thing. Not sure that can happen but it isn’t happening in the CPC and I’m not sure it can ever happen.

I am not sure there is any chance of the red ship being righted at this point. It seems destined role as far left as it can.

I curse you Peter MacKay.
 

RangerRay

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
740
Points
1,110
It may be time for moderate conservatives to just move to team red and effect change from there. Let the CPC become a protest party and be perpetually stuck in opposition . They’ve shown that they don’t want to govern seriously.

Unless they can get a leader that can keep the party in line (and I can’t see anyone that can) then time for a different approach.
As long as they remain a corrupt, unserious party in the thrall of the United Front Work Department of the Chinese Communist Party, and with Justin Trudeau as leader, I cannot in good conscience vote Liberal. I would sooner stay home on Election Day.
 

Good2Golf

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Mentor
Reaction score
8,292
Points
1,360
I am not sure there is any chance of the red ship being righted at this point. It seems destined role as far left as it can.

I curse you Peter MacKay.
Don’t you mean you curse all the CPC members who voted for O’Toole INSTEAD of Peter MacKay?

I think only Rona Ambrose could salvage the CPC crap-show at this point. Possibly Remple-Garner…
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,260
Points
1,260
Don’t you mean you curse all the CPC members who voted for O’Toole INSTEAD of Peter MacKay?

I think only Rona Ambrose could salvage the COC crap-show at this point. Possibly Remple-Garner…

No I curse MacKay for giving up the PC Party. They should have stuck it out.

I agree on Rona Amborse, but I think she is too intelligent to put her hat in with these fools currently in the CPC.
 

Czech_pivo

Army.ca Veteran
Subscriber
Reaction score
1,576
Points
1,140
I have been ver disappointed with Mr. O’Toole lately. At first I thought it would be stupid to replace the leader again in so many years but he never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

I am not confident that the Tories will find anyone better though. A lot of people are talking about Pierre Pollievre, but I think he’s a good attack dog, not a leader. He will just turn the party into a base-only party, turning off the suburban voters they need to win elections.

Unfortunately, I see the Tories trying to ape the”popular front” politics down south of “no enemies to the right” (or “no enemies to the left” if you’re a Dem). Great for getting 25% of the vote who are p!$$ed off but not great if you want to govern with a majority.
The fellow who I like, have meet, years ago when he first ran and represented my old riding, is Mike Chong. Principled, old school PC tory and not a religious zealot that seems to run just below the surface of the last 2-3 Conservative leaders.

EDIT: And he's a Windsor, Ontario boy just like me, so I'm partial to this....being a Tory in Windsor makes you quick on your feet and sometimes with your fists, lol.
 

Czech_pivo

Army.ca Veteran
Subscriber
Reaction score
1,576
Points
1,140
No I curse MacKay for giving up the PC Party. They should have stuck it out.

I agree on Rona Amborse, but I think she is too intelligent to put her hat in with these fools currently in the CPC.
Yes, I feel strongly that Peter sold us out. I still think that he's capable and could make a difference/contribution but as for a leader, I think that the ship has sailed.
 

Good2Golf

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Mentor
Reaction score
8,292
Points
1,360
No I curse MacKay for giving up the PC Party. They should have stuck it out.
Ah, seen…we’ll, it was in good faith with Harper and “the deal” would have seen a transfer of leadership after the first full majority, so I think that at the time, it was an appropriate decision…but Harper and the further/far right reneged (therein dissing the larger PC crowd as well) and the Red(dest) Tories plugged their noses as they saw the rising SOCON tide.

I agree on Rona Amborse, but I think she is too intelligent to put her hat in with these fools currently in the CPC.
Sadly, I think you’re right. The SOCON hijack needs to burn itself out…if ever. If it doesn’t, then it will be a bad time for Canada as we spend ourselves blissfully into oblivion (and de facto takeover by the CCP). Definitely very little strategic thought going on in the CPC these days.

Just out of interest, MacKay should re-register the PCs and see how that flies. It may actually recover many of the Red Tories and even some Blue Liberals, and then do a coalition with the CPC and punt Trudeau Jr… 🤔
 

Remius

Army.ca Fixture
Reaction score
3,622
Points
1,090
I agree that Ambrose was the way to go. But yes. She’s too smart and likely saw the writing on the wall and wanted nothing to do with that mess.
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,260
Points
1,260
Ah, seen…we’ll, it was in good faith with Harper and “the deal” would have seen a transfer of leadership after the first full majority, so I think that at the time, it was an appropriate decision…but Harper and the further/far right reneged (therein dissing the larger PC crowd as well) and the Red(dest) Tories plugged their noses as they saw the rising SOCON tide.

I never took Harper as a SOCON. But I could be wrong. Ya as a red torrie I have been consistently pushed away from the party.

Sadly, I think you’re right. The SOCON hijack needs to burn itself out…if ever. If it doesn’t, then it will be a bad time for Canada as we spend ourselves blissfully into oblivion (and de facto takeover by the CCP). Definitely very little strategic thought going on in the COC these days.

Just out of interest, MacKay should re-register the PCs and see how that flies. It may actually recover many of the Red Tories and even some Blue Liberals, and then do a coalition with the CPC and punt Trudeau Jr… 🤔

I would love to see this.
 

Czech_pivo

Army.ca Veteran
Subscriber
Reaction score
1,576
Points
1,140
Just out of interest, MacKay should re-register the PCs and see how that flies. It may actually recover many of the Red Tories and even some Blue Liberals, and then do a coalition with the CPC and punt Trudeau Jr… 🤔
I'm fairly certain that the conditions of the 'merger' included the name 'Progressive Conservative', 'PC' and 'Progressive Conservative Party of Canada' terms/logos to be no longer used/available.
 

Good2Golf

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Mentor
Reaction score
8,292
Points
1,360
I'm fairly certain that the conditions of the 'merger' included the name 'Progressive Conservative', 'PC' and 'Progressive Conservative Party of Canada' terms/logos to be no longer used/available.
So? 😉

Harper broke the agreement. So it would arguably be null and void. MacKay is a good enough lawyer that he’d be able to easily justify moving on as the PCs.
 

RangerRay

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
740
Points
1,110
I didn’t see Harper as the religious bogey man here. I have heard they intensely dislike him because he put them in a box labelled “DO NOT OPEN”. Now that he’s gone, they are letting their freak flag fly.

I saw the merger as an opportunity for both parties, that agreed on 90% of things, to jettison their extremists and work together on a common liberal-conservative cause. Unfortunately, the departure of Mr. Harper coincided with the rise of far-right populism and all the media incentive structures that fueled it. Now a sizeable chunk of the party thinks they can catch lightning in a bottle like their Republican counterparts, not realizing the electoral system here will not allow that to work. It also appears that like many Republican politicians down south, many Tory politicians here are more afraid of their supporters than the general electorate.
 

Remius

Army.ca Fixture
Reaction score
3,622
Points
1,090
I know this is premature.

So I had mentioned this a while ago about Doug Ford making a run for the leadership. Now Gerald Butts (I know I know) tweeted something similar that Ford would be a very tough candidate to beat.

Thoughts?
 

Eaglelord17

Sr. Member
Reaction score
428
Points
810
There is a big difference between Canada and the USA though. In the US you only have two parties. In Canada you have 6 parties splitting votes, which is why you can win majorities with only 35ish % of the vote.

Remember the CPC won the popular vote for two consecutive elections, they were more popular than the Liberals which everyone seems to think they need to be more like. If the PPC didn't exist they likely could have won both of them. There issue isn't so much who they have running for them it is where the votes are being cast (i.e. Liberals tend to have more spread out voting, as opposed to the CPC which tends to win by landslides in some areas and not get much in others), and the fact so many Canadians are ignorant as to what they CPC is standing for.

The reason this last point is a issue is because they haven't been releasing their policies for the last couple elections and it has allowed so many attack ads to have much more of a effect because without anything countering that the Liberals can make any claim they want. Stop with the gotcha style of attacks, they are childish and only appeal to their hardcore supporters. Simply ignore the competition and state how you are going to make Canada better and why your policies will work. To do this you need to set ground rules as to what your policies are actually going to be and make everyone fall in line on them.

No banning abortion talk. No banning gays talk. None of the common things Canadians hate but somehow always gets brought up by some member of the CPC as a good idea talk. Show yourselves as a viable option, and do it long enough in advance to allow Canadians to see that before the election.

If I was the Liberal Party I would be more concerned than the Conservatives. They are the one losing voting space to the left and right and now seemingly unable to get enough votes to put them over the top.
 

RangerRay

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
740
Points
1,110
I know this is premature.

So I had mentioned this a while ago about Doug Ford making a run for the leadership. Now Gerald Butts (I know I know) tweeted something similar that Ford would be a very tough candidate to beat.

Thoughts?
I won’t count him out. He comes with a lot of baggage and other negatives, but for all his bluster, I think he’s a more moderate Tory compared to some of these other guys. Not my first choice, but watch and shoot!
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,260
Points
1,260
I know this is premature.

So I had mentioned this a while ago about Doug Ford making a run for the leadership. Now Gerald Butts (I know I know) tweeted something similar that Ford would be a very tough candidate to beat.

Thoughts?


Has he maintained his popularity in Ont ?
 

The Bread Guy

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Donor
Reaction score
2,341
Points
1,260
... Just out of interest, MacKay should re-register the PCs and see how that flies. It may actually recover many of the Red Tories and even some Blue Liberals, and then do a coalition with the CPC and punt Trudeau Jr… 🤔
Up to the bit in yellow, intriguing idea. What would the chances be, though, of Peter M being able to bridge the gap that would be in place between a slightly-redder Team Blue 2.0 and the existing Team Blue 1.0?
 

Remius

Army.ca Fixture
Reaction score
3,622
Points
1,090
I won’t count him out. He comes with a lot of baggage and other negatives, but for all his bluster, I think he’s a more moderate Tory compared to some of these other guys. Not my first choice, but watch and shoot!
I’m curious how this could play out. A provincial election is coming. So let’s say he wins (I think he will). Then he makes a run for the CPC. Nothing says he has to have a seat in the HoC until it’s time for an election which could be two years from now.

Could he actuallly be premier of Ontario and leader of the federal Opposition? Seems like an unprecedented thing that brings up all sorts of interesting scenarios. For a while (and maybe still) he was the face of conservatives in Canada so it wouldn’t be that far off the realm of possibility.

Anyways just playing fantasy football here.
 
Top